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General Forums => Board News => Topic started by: Sveti Naum Ohridski on February 13, 2013, 06:21:03 AM

Title: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Sveti Naum Ohridski on February 13, 2013, 06:21:03 AM
Hello to all my Orthodox brothers and sisters. I thought I would make my first post on here just to say hi.  :)
I am a Macedonian Orthodox Christian and I originate from Lerin (Florina) in today's northern Greece.

My Families patron saint, going down the paternal line is Saint Petka (Parascheva).
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Ansgar on February 13, 2013, 06:23:03 AM
Man, we are getting flooded with macedonians.

Welcome  :)
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Cyrillic on February 13, 2013, 06:23:22 AM
Hello. You're the second FYROMian within a few days time. You guys are cute.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Sveti Naum Ohridski on February 13, 2013, 06:25:37 AM
Hello. You're the second FYROMian within a few days time. You guys are cute.

Why use that insulting word?

Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Cyrillic on February 13, 2013, 06:33:12 AM
How's it insulting?
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Ansgar on February 13, 2013, 06:37:47 AM
How's it insulting?

I don't think they like the term FYROM.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Sveti Naum Ohridski on February 13, 2013, 06:42:58 AM
How's it insulting?

It's insulting because people like you call us that against our will. It is derogatory to us. To be honest, I did't expect that in a Christian forum. I am assuming you are Serb? Which would explain your attitude.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Ansgar on February 13, 2013, 06:44:48 AM
How's it insulting?

It's insulting because people like you call us that against our will. It is derogatory to us. To be honest, I did't expect that in a Christian forum. I am assuming you are Serb? Which would explain your attitude.

He's dutch.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Sveti Naum Ohridski on February 13, 2013, 06:46:25 AM
How's it insulting?

I don't think they like the term FYROM.

Well, what's to like about it? It's a name imposed on us by the UN, who in fact broke their own charter. Now the Greeks and some Serbs use it against us as a ethnonym by adding 'ian' at the end.  >:(
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Ansgar on February 13, 2013, 06:55:02 AM
How's it insulting?

I don't think they like the term FYROM.

Well, what's to like about it? It's a name imposed on us by the UN, who in fact broke their own charter. Now the Greeks and some Serbs use it against us as a ethnonym by adding 'ian' at the end.  >:(
Well, if it helps, I'm pretty sure most people around the world just call you macedonians.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Cyrillic on February 13, 2013, 06:57:06 AM
I did't expect that in a Christian forum. I am assuming you are Serb?

 ::)
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Sveti Naum Ohridski on February 13, 2013, 06:58:15 AM
How's it insulting?

I don't think they like the term FYROM.

Well, what's to like about it? It's a name imposed on us by the UN, who in fact broke their own charter. Now the Greeks and some Serbs use it against us as a ethnonym by adding 'ian' at the end.  >:(
Well, if it helps, I'm pretty sure most people around the world just call you macedonians.

We are recognized by over 130 countries around the world as the Republic of Macedonia and not 'fyrom'. I think that's what matters more.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Sveti Naum Ohridski on February 13, 2013, 06:59:20 AM
I did't expect that in a Christian forum. I am assuming you are Serb?

 ::)

I would never have guessed you as a Dutch Orthodox. Never even heard of one. lol
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Cyrillic on February 13, 2013, 07:01:10 AM
I did't expect that in a Christian forum. I am assuming you are Serb?

 ::)

I would never have guessed you as a Dutch Orthodox. Never even heard of one. lol

We Dutch don't try to attract too much attention. We're all very humble  :)
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Ansgar on February 13, 2013, 07:07:37 AM
I did't expect that in a Christian forum. I am assuming you are Serb?

 ::)

I would never have guessed you as a Dutch Orthodox. Never even heard of one. lol

We Dutch don't try to attract too much attention. We're all very humble  :)
Sure you are.  ;)
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Servos on February 13, 2013, 07:59:29 AM
Macedonia is only one and it is Greek.

Orthodox Christians are those who are in communion with Patriarch Bartholomew (or for Oriental Orthodox with Pope Theodore).
You are not. And you know the name for such people.

If you are come hear to spread propaganda you'll find hard opposition.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Asteriktos on February 13, 2013, 08:05:11 AM
Orthodox Christians are those who are in communion with Patriarch Bartholomew (or for Oriental Orthodox with Pope Theodore).

I don't know much about Macedon, but I know the above is shoddy ecclesiology.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Ansgar on February 13, 2013, 08:07:12 AM
I seriously don't understand all the fuss about the name. So what if they want to call their country Macedonia and themselves macedonians?
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Αριστοκλής on February 13, 2013, 08:40:14 AM
How's it insulting?

I don't think they like the term FYROM.

That's too bad.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: mike on February 13, 2013, 08:44:21 AM
If you are come hear to spread propaganda you'll find hard opposition.

Calm down, really. Don't submit such pathetic messages.

I seriously don't understand all the fuss about the name. So what if they want to call their country Macedonia and themselves macedonians?

The weaker the nation is, the more militantly it behaves.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Servos on February 13, 2013, 08:45:04 AM
So what if they want to call their country Macedonia and themselves macedonians?
The problem is that Macedonia already exist and Macedonians also.

This new "Macedonians", "Macedonia" and "Macedonain church" are created from Communist in 1945.

Someone can be Klingonian if he will, no problem of course. But he can not steel some other name.

Macedonia is Greek. And capital is Thessaloniki.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macedonia_%28Greece%29 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macedonia_%28Greece%29)
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Servos on February 13, 2013, 08:48:06 AM
I don't know much about Macedon, but I know the above is shoddy ecclesiology.

Obviously you don't know much.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Asteriktos on February 13, 2013, 08:50:26 AM
I don't know much about Macedon, but I know the above is shoddy ecclesiology.

Obviously you don't know much.

I know that the Pope of Rome made the same kind of ecclesiological claims since the first millenium, and that wasn't orthodox either. Never has the body of Christ, or Orthodoxy, or Catholicism, depended on being in communion with a particular person or place. Not even when St. Theodosius said it did.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Nephi on February 13, 2013, 08:50:39 AM
Orthodox Christians are those who are in communion with Patriarch Bartholomew (or for Oriental Orthodox with Pope Theodore).

I don't know much about Macedon, but I know the above is shoddy ecclesiology.

I've seen this type of ecclesiology come up a few times recently, and I don't see where it comes from.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Servos on February 13, 2013, 08:51:40 AM
Don't submit such pathetic messages.
Look at your pathetic signature first.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: mike on February 13, 2013, 08:54:40 AM
Don't submit such pathetic messages.
Look at your pathetic signature first.

I do not haunt for other users and tell them they are not allowed to be Russian / Greek / Serbian / whatever.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Ansgar on February 13, 2013, 08:55:08 AM
So what if they want to call their country Macedonia and themselves macedonians?
The problem is that Macedonia already exist and Macedonians also.

This new "Macedonians", "Macedonia" and "Macedonain church" are created from Communist in 1945.

Someone can be Klingonian if he will, no problem of course. But he can not steel some other name.

Macedonia is Greek. And capital is Thessaloniki.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macedonia_%28Greece%29 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macedonia_%28Greece%29)
I still think it is stupid. Why can't they just both be called Macedonia? I can't believe people are actually hating each other over this.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Asteriktos on February 13, 2013, 08:56:32 AM
I keep thinking "Mastodon" every time I read "Macedonia"...
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Servos on February 13, 2013, 08:58:40 AM
I know that the Pope of Rome made the same kind of ecclesiological claims since the first millenium, and that wasn't orthodox either. Never has the body of Christ, or Orthodoxy, or Catholicism, depended on being in communion with a particular person or place. Not even when St. Theodosius said it did.

Dear, I spoke here with FYROM-ian and I have intention in one word to say that they are not in the communion with no one.
They are not in communion with Alexandrian Patriarch, nor with Antiochian, nor with OCA, nor with GOARC (Greek Orthodox Diocese in USA), nor with Japan Orthodox Church, nor with ROCOR, nor with Polish Orthoodox Church, etc.
To avoid to number all of this, I mentioned just Patr. Bartholomew as first among the equal of all Orthodox bishops.
Don't make problem now where there is no problem.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: mike on February 13, 2013, 09:00:59 AM
I know that the Pope of Rome made the same kind of ecclesiological claims since the first millenium, and that wasn't orthodox either. Never has the body of Christ, or Orthodoxy, or Catholicism, depended on being in communion with a particular person or place. Not even when St. Theodosius said it did.

Dear, I spoke here with FYROM-ian and I have intention in one word to say that they are not in the communion with no one.
They are not in communion with Alexandrian Patriarch, nor with Antiochian, nor with OCA, nor with GOARC (Greek Orthodox Diocese in USA), nor with Japan Orthodox Church, nor with ROCOR, nor with Polish Orthoodox Church, etc.
To avoid to number all of this, I mentioned just Patr. Bartholomew as first among the equal of all Orthodox bishops.
Don't make problem now where there is no problem.

They are in communion with Kiev Patriarchate, and Bulgarian Alternative Synod (if it still exists).
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Ansgar on February 13, 2013, 09:01:56 AM
I know that the Pope of Rome made the same kind of ecclesiological claims since the first millenium, and that wasn't orthodox either. Never has the body of Christ, or Orthodoxy, or Catholicism, depended on being in communion with a particular person or place. Not even when St. Theodosius said it did.

Dear, I spoke here with FYROM-ian and I have intention in one word to say that they are not in the communion with no one.
They are not in communion with Alexandrian Patriarch, nor with Antiochian, nor with OCA, nor with GOARC (Greek Orthodox Diocese in USA), nor with Japan Orthodox Church, nor with ROCOR, nor with Polish Orthoodox Church, etc.
To avoid to number all of this, I mentioned just Patr. Bartholomew as first among the equal of all Orthodox bishops.
Don't make problem now where there is no problem.

They are in communion with Kiev Patriarchate, and Bulgarian Alternative Synod (if it still exists).

Really? I didn't know that.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: mike on February 13, 2013, 09:03:44 AM
I know that the Pope of Rome made the same kind of ecclesiological claims since the first millenium, and that wasn't orthodox either. Never has the body of Christ, or Orthodoxy, or Catholicism, depended on being in communion with a particular person or place. Not even when St. Theodosius said it did.

Dear, I spoke here with FYROM-ian and I have intention in one word to say that they are not in the communion with no one.
They are not in communion with Alexandrian Patriarch, nor with Antiochian, nor with OCA, nor with GOARC (Greek Orthodox Diocese in USA), nor with Japan Orthodox Church, nor with ROCOR, nor with Polish Orthoodox Church, etc.
To avoid to number all of this, I mentioned just Patr. Bartholomew as first among the equal of all Orthodox bishops.
Don't make problem now where there is no problem.

They are in communion with Kiev Patriarchate, and Bulgarian Alternative Synod (if it still exists).

Really? I didn't know that.

If I'm not mistaken...
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Servos on February 13, 2013, 09:04:39 AM
I still think it is stupid. Why can't they just both be called Macedonia? I can't believe people are actually hating each other over this.
Search the interent and you will see why it is not stupid.
If Serbian, Bulgarian and Greek Churches and governments and people see the problem probably there is a problem.
Have you ever been in Greece? In Serbia? In Skopje?
Probably no.
Leave then us to solve our problems.
And you solve the problems of your country.
I don't say that problems of your country are stupid.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Servos on February 13, 2013, 09:10:17 AM
Kiev Patriarchat (not under Patriarch Cyrill), Alternative Bulgarian Church, Montenegro Orthodox Church, "Macedonian" Orthodox Church... nice company.
They are not in communion with Alexandrian, or Antiochian, or Jerusalim Patriarch.
But of course, they are between them. If some of them still exist, of course.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Ansgar on February 13, 2013, 09:11:45 AM
I still think it is stupid. Why can't they just both be called Macedonia? I can't believe people are actually hating each other over this.
Search the interent and you will see why it is not stupid.
If Serbian, Bulgarian and Greek Churches and governments and people see the problem probably there is a problem.
Have you ever been in Greece? In Serbia? In Skopje?
Probably no.
Leave then us to solve our problems.
And you solve the problems of your country.
I don't say that problems of your country are stupid.
Firstly, just because a lot of people think there is a problem, it doesn't mean that there really is one.

Secondly, If you don't wan't other people to adress this issue, you shouldn't bring up the topic on a public forum.

And yes I have been to Greece, it was very lovely. I could see all the way to Turkey from our hotel.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Ansgar on February 13, 2013, 09:29:34 AM
Servos, allow me clarify.

I can understand that Greece wants to protect its cultural heritage. But when I look at the posts from serbs and greeks and macedonians, I can't help but wonder if it's reayy worth all the fight because of a name. That the coutnry call itself Macedonia doesn't change the fact that there is a province in Greece with the same name and that the people in that province also call themselves macedonians. Nobody have taken that from them. 
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Tommelomsky on February 13, 2013, 10:09:09 AM
Hello and welcome from tiny tiny Norway (that little spot up in north close to Iceland in north and UK in the west). :)
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Ansgar on February 13, 2013, 10:24:40 AM
Hello and welcome from tiny tiny Norway (that little spot up in north close to Iceland in north and UK in the west). :)

Tiny?

Don't be modest Tommy.  :)
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Servos on February 13, 2013, 11:47:23 AM
just because a lot of people think there is a problem, it doesn't mean that there really is one.

ALL Orthodox people in Serbia, Greece and Bulgaria think that artificially created Church form Communists is the problem.
If some Americans and others don't see the problem, then you have problem, not we.

But, I so often see protestantic spirit in former protestants, who wants to tech Jerusalim Patriarch, and Antochian, and Serbian, and Greek. All are wrong just you have the right.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Ansgar on February 13, 2013, 11:59:24 AM
just because a lot of people think there is a problem, it doesn't mean that there really is one.

ALL Orthodox people in Serbia, Greece and Bulgaria think that artificially created Church form Communists is the problem.
If you Americans and others don't see the problem, then you have problem, not we.

But, I so often see protestantic spirit in former protestants, who wants to tech Jerusalim Patriarch, and Antochian, and Serbian, and Greek. All are wrong just you have the right.
I'm very sorry if I have offended you, but if you read the post you are quoting from again, you will surely see that I wasn't talking about the macedonian church, which I do not see as the legitimate church of Macedonia, but rather about the macedonian nation and the dispute about it's name.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Cyrillic on February 13, 2013, 12:00:46 PM
Lesson 1: Don't get involved in Balkan politics.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Αριστοκλής on February 13, 2013, 12:01:00 PM
just because a lot of people think there is a problem, it doesn't mean that there really is one.

ALL Orthodox people in Serbia, Greece and Bulgaria think that artificially created Church form Communists is the problem.
If you Americans and others don't see the problem, then you have problem, not we.

But, I so often see protestantic spirit in former protestants, who wants to tech Jerusalim Patriarch, and Antochian, and Serbian, and Greek. All are wrong just you have the right.

Please don't use the term "you Americans" as if we all think alike. If you think that then you DO have a problem.  ;)
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Αριστοκλής on February 13, 2013, 12:01:54 PM
Lesson 1: Don't get involved in Balkan politics.

Wise beyond your years...
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Servos on February 13, 2013, 12:12:26 PM
I'm very sorry if I have offended you, but if you read the post you are quoting from again, you will surely see that I wasn't talking about the macedonian church, which I do not see as the legitimate church of Macedonia, but rather about the macedonian nation and the dispute about it's name.
"Macedonian" nation, language, church... is communistic creation after World War II.
Like Norway is Norway. It can not be Sweden or Denmark.
The same way FYROM is whatever they want but can not be Greece, Macedonia, Serbia or Bulgaria.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Servos on February 13, 2013, 12:14:58 PM
Please don't use the term "you Americans" as if we all think alike. If you think that then you DO have a problem.  ;)
Sorry brother, you are right!
I change the post.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Servos on February 13, 2013, 12:17:26 PM
Lesson 1: Don't get involved in Balkan politics.
(http://www.pouke.org/forum/public/style_emoticons/default/smil443643319dc3d.gif)
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: Ansgar on February 13, 2013, 12:18:34 PM
I'm very sorry if I have offended you, but if you read the post you are quoting from again, you will surely see that I wasn't talking about the macedonian church, which I do not see as the legitimate church of Macedonia, but rather about the macedonian nation and the dispute about it's name.
"Macedonian" nation, language, church... is communistic creation after World War II.
Like Norway is Norway. It can not be Sweden or Denmark.
The same way FYROM is whatever they want but can not be Greece, Macedonia, Serbia or Bulgaria.
But the province of Macedonia is not an independent nation like Denmark or Sweden. Besides, on the historical map, I have seen, the ancient kingdom of Macedonia was partly situated in what is modern FYROM/Macedonia.
Title: Re: Hello Zdravo
Post by: mike on February 13, 2013, 12:32:36 PM
Locking it permanently unless people higher than me decide otherwise. That "discussion" can be continued here (http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,49909.0.html).