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Moderated Forums => Liturgy => Topic started by: SakranMM on December 05, 2006, 01:33:51 PM

Title: Lord's Prayer in Arabic
Post by: SakranMM on December 05, 2006, 01:33:51 PM
Can someone transliterate this into English for me?  I found a phonetical transliteration on the Melkite Catholic website, but the translation is a bit different from what is used in my Antiochian parish as far as I can tell. 

I've got this much so far:

"Ab'nladhee, fee samawat, liyataq'das ismok.  Liyati malakatuk, litakon mahshee atok, kama fee sama kadhaleeka al la'ard...."

I hope someone can help this poor 2nd-generation Arab out who hardly knows his own language.

In Christ,

Michael
Title: Re: Lord's Prayer in Arabic
Post by: FrChris on December 05, 2006, 02:57:31 PM
I have transliterated into English the Doxology for the prayer (For yours is the Kingdom, etc), but not the full prayer itself:

Li-an-na laka>l-mul-ka, wal-qoo-wa-ta, wal-maj-da, ai-yu-ha>l aabu wa-lib-nu  war-ru-khul qoodus: al-aana wa-kul-la awaa-nen wa-ilaa dah-ri>d daa-hi-reen

Unfortunately I can't get all the letters for the pronunciation guide in there, but the following is my attempts to indicate:

>: is the glottal used in quickly migrating from a vowel to a consonant
aa: ah
kh: this is supposed to be the letter 'qaf', not 'kaf'

Hope this helps! I also would like to see the transliteration into English as well!
Title: Re: Lord's Prayer in Arabic
Post by: arimethea on December 05, 2006, 07:32:27 PM
Can someone transliterate this into English for me?  I found a phonetical transliteration on the Melkite Catholic website, but the translation is a bit different from what is used in my Antiochian parish as far as I can tell. 
There are minor differences in the "Our Father" between what the Catholics and the Orthodox use in the Arabic language.
Title: Re: Lord's Prayer in Arabic
Post by: SakranMM on December 05, 2006, 08:54:33 PM
Thanks everyone.  I hope there's someone out there who's got it. 
Title: Re: Lord's Prayer in Arabic
Post by: Thanatos on December 05, 2006, 10:17:35 PM
I asked my Coptic friend in Egypt:

abana allazy fe al samawat
le yatakaddas esmok
le yaaty malakotak
le takon masheaatak , kama fe al samaa kazalek aala el ard
khobzana kafafana aatena al yaoum
wa eghfor lana zenobana , kama naghfor nahno aydan lel mozneben elayna
wa la todkhelna fe tagroba , wa laken naggena min al sherer
be el Maseeh Yasoua Rabena , leaan laka al molk wa al kowa wa al magd ela al abad amin

Peace,
Ioannis
Title: Re: Lord's Prayer in Arabic
Post by: EkhristosAnesti on December 05, 2006, 10:35:35 PM
Quote
be el Maseeh Yasoua Rabena , leaan laka al molk wa al kowa wa al magd ela al abad amin


This last bit is an addition to the Lord's prayer which translates: "Through Jesus Christ our Lord, for Thine is the Kingdom, the Power, and the Glory, Forever and Ever. Amen"

I just thought I'd point that out in case EO's don't have this conclusion attached to their version of the Lord's prayer.
Title: Re: Lord's Prayer in Arabic
Post by: SakranMM on December 06, 2006, 10:22:29 PM
That sounds much closer to Antiochian practice than that of the Melkites; I know its difficult to transliterate it into English and capture the same accents on a message board, but saying out loud I can hear and pick up enough of what I'm used to hearing.  Thanks so much.

In Christ,

Michael
Title: Re: Lord's Prayer in Arabic
Post by: SamB on December 09, 2006, 04:36:38 AM
Consider this the definitive version (versions in fact; I'll provide both the Orthodox and the Melchite forms of the prayer), but first a detailed pronunciation guide from myself:

'Kh' is the Greek Χ, or more accurately, the broader, rougher Scottish 'ch' (Loch Ness)
'Gh' is the French 'r', somewhat similar to the Greek Γ
'Q' is a rolled version of 'k', that originates from deep down in the throat, a voiced velar that is perhaps the most difficult of Arabic consonants for the foreigner to pronounce.

Short/long vowel pairs:
A/AA [Fat(h)ah/Alif] Greek Α (The short consonant may sometimes sound like the 'u' in 'cub', as in Rab, meaning Lord.)
U/OO [(D)am'ma/Waaw] Greek ΟΥ (the 'oo' in 'moon')
I/EE [Kasra/Yaa'] Greek Η (the 'ee' in 'seen')

N.B. Some vowels at the end of words, written as long vowels in script, will still be pronounced short.  These are written as short vowels in the transliteration.

Parenthesised letters are rolled.  They become velars.

The paranthesised (h), however, is a consonant that sounds like an exhaled breath.  Velar, voiceless, and aspirated.

'Th' is that in 'though', '(th)' (in parenthesis) is its rolled equivalent, and 'th' (underlined), is that of 'thorn', meaning the Greek letter Θ.

The hyphen indicates the joining of the article 'the' with a word.  It has the same effect on pronunciation as the apostrophe, described later onward.

`, as opposed to a regular apostrophe ', is the consonant `ayn (or `ein, as some prefer to write it).  I still do not know how to describe it adequately, except that it is, I believe, a glottal fricative.

The apostrophe indicates a normal glottal start/stop, except when it exists between two identical consonants, in which case it indicates that the word should be pronounced as two different words (with no significant pause in between and with the last letter of the first 'word' held until the next letter is pronounced). So rad'did is pronounced rad did (without pause or letting go of the first 'd') and not radid.
Title: Re: Lord's Prayer in Arabic
Post by: SamB on December 09, 2006, 05:02:50 AM
Where the two prayers diverge from one another, the bold text is the Orthodox version:

Important note:  Levantine Christians (namely Syrians and Lebanese) sometimes tend to retain idiosyncrasies of their vernacular dialects when pronouncing the classical Fu(s)(h)ah Arabic, namely pronouncing the 'th' (that of 'though') as a 'z', and the 'th' of 'thorn' as an 's'.  Therefore, you will hear the people in church say -- from the first line of the prayer -- al-lazi, instead of al-lathi.  This is just plain wrong, and more especially so when the same is applied to what is chanted in Greek ('Agios Asanatos', 'O Seos Imon': *shudder*), and so I will retain the classical letter 'th' and 'th' in the transliterations.  (A tip of the hat to the Jordanians for doing things properly.)

Also, in the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th lines, the final 'a' of the last word of each is sometimes omitted.  I keep these here.

Abaanal-lathi fis-samawaat,
Liyataqad'das ismuka
Liya'ti malakootuka
Litakun mashee'atuka
Kama fis-samaa'i kathaalika `alal-ard
A`(t)ina khubzana kafaafa yowmina / Khubzanal-jowhari a`(t)inal-yawm
Waghfir lana (sometimes omitted: thunoobana wa) kha(t)ayaana / Watruk lana maa `alayna
Kama naghfiru na(h)nu liman (sometimes omitted: akh(t)a'a wa) asaa'a ilayna / kama natruku na(h)nu liman lana `alayh
Walaa tudkhilna fit-tajaarib / Walaa tudkhilna fi tajriba
Laakin naj'jina minash-shar'reer

Li'an'na lakal-mulka wal-qudrata wal-majd, ay'yuhal Aabu wal-Ibnu war-Roo(h)ul-Qudus al'aana wa kul'la awaanin wa ila dahrid-daahireen.  Aameen.
Title: Re: Lord's Prayer in Arabic
Post by: SakranMM on December 09, 2006, 01:10:27 PM
Thanks, Samer

In Christ,

SakrAAn (the drunk one)