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Author Topic: Homosexulaity and the Church--was part of Re: Interesting development in the OCA  (Read 20812 times) Average Rating: 0
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augustin717
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« on: August 10, 2011, 12:15:42 AM »

What a  joke. Hopefully they'll find some other excuse than his alleged homosexuality or else they'll have to explain why nothing happens to those afflicted with similar "passions" in the hierarchy. The  conservative  metropolitan's dealings with Gleb Podmoshenski do not look quite kosher either.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2011, 12:16:46 AM by augustin717 » Logged
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« Reply #1 on: August 10, 2011, 12:21:10 AM »

So the witch hunting season has officially started. Will all unmarried parishioners be considered suspects, until proven "straight"?
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« Reply #2 on: August 10, 2011, 12:24:16 AM »

What a  joke. Hopefully they'll find some other excuse than his alleged homosexuality or else they'll have to explain why nothing happens to those afflicted with similar "passions" in the hierarchy.
Like whom?
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augustin717
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« Reply #3 on: August 10, 2011, 01:17:07 AM »

He also shared a cell, apparently, with Gleb Podmoshenski. The irony...
But yeah, I can see how formerly conservative Protestants get all excited over this stuff. It's actually what made them come into the OC. Who cares.
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« Reply #4 on: August 10, 2011, 01:25:42 AM »

It's odd that you pawn this (like everything else) off on Protestantism, when Protestantism, at large, is more accepting of homosexuality. To suggest that these things should be a non-issue to the OC is silly. Have you been to Eastern Europe?
And yes, I know you have.
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« Reply #5 on: August 10, 2011, 01:28:23 AM »

He also shared a cell, apparently, with Gleb Podmoshenski. The irony...
But yeah, I can see how formerly conservative Protestants get all excited over this stuff. It's actually what made them come into the OC. Who cares.

Oh my Roll Eyes

Maybe a few disaffected Anglicans, but please.

The Protestant church I came from is less tolerant of homosexuality than the OC is. This letter from +Matthias is rather on an even keel compared to a lot of Protestants. So...shrill nonsense.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2011, 01:31:17 AM by bogdan » Logged
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« Reply #6 on: August 10, 2011, 01:31:59 AM »

So the witch hunting season has officially started. Will all unmarried parishioners be considered suspects, until proven "straight"?

In my parish they will! Beware you spinsters of magic and evil between the ages of 18 and 30! You will be put to the test.

I am willing to run this contest as well. //:=)
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augustin717
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« Reply #7 on: August 10, 2011, 01:32:50 AM »

ican sniff a former Protestant from a couple of miles away. police
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« Reply #8 on: August 10, 2011, 01:34:54 AM »

As has been mentioned before, we can certainly have monks, Priests and Bishops that are "gay", but they absolutely cannot be practicing, and cannot try to justify their actions or feelings. Look at Fr. Seraphim Rose, he was a homosexual, but he left his partner and his lifestyle when he entered the Church, and rejected the homosexual lifestyle.

What about practicing masturbators? Liars? Gluttons? Back Biters? Wait that last one is sorta . . .
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« Reply #9 on: August 10, 2011, 01:36:23 AM »

It's odd that you pawn this (like everything else) off on Protestantism, when Protestantism, at large, is more accepting of homosexuality. To suggest that these things should be a non-issue to the OC is silly. Have you been to Eastern Europe?
And yes, I know you have.
Yeah I have. You know how it's where i come from? Nothing ever changes in the books, nothing is ever enforced either. But it takes a former Protestant (or sometimes even RC) to think that because something it's written in a book it actually has to be enforced etc. it's a free for all sort of religion-not talking just about homosexuality-that doesn't police people's lives.
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« Reply #10 on: August 10, 2011, 01:37:24 AM »

Have you been to Eastern Europe?
And yes, I know you have.

Have you, besides your "tour abroad"?

And yes, I know you haven't.
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« Reply #11 on: August 10, 2011, 01:37:32 AM »

The zeal with which many Orthodox (and not just converts in America, but the cradle churches in at least in Russia and Serbia it seems to me - please don't ask me to cite or I must retract) attack the modern feeling for affirming homosexuality (as indistinguishable between 'orientation' and sexual practice) does seem to be a big draw for disowned-feeling fundamentalists or conservatives in the mainline Protestant and evangelical churches.  For me personally, a homo drawn to a more fundamentalist(ic) worldview supposedly historically Christian, that would be perfectly fine if the Orthodox Church were as zealous to defend the purity of Christian teaching and practice from all other maladies of thinking and practice that might afflict the believers.   Unfortunately I don't see it, except in rather vague terms (in so many of the prayers, and in the more-specific Ecumenical Councils that are, however, subject to bishops' economy) - so the sweeping and clarified position against all homosexuality just can leave one wanting.  (Reflection 1:  divorce and remarriage.  The golden "out" for this one is that the act of divorce is one separatable act of sin, whereas the homosexual state is one ongoing and never-remitting, so happy-be-lonely to those afflicted with it.)  My view anyway...
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« Reply #12 on: August 10, 2011, 01:40:48 AM »

Can we move this to politics private now, so that we can really speak openly?

//:=)
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« Reply #13 on: August 10, 2011, 01:42:22 AM »

The zeal with which many Orthodox (and not just converts in America, but the cradle churches in at least in Russia and Serbia it seems to me - please don't ask me to cite or I must retract) attack the modern feeling for affirming homosexuality (as indistinguishable between 'orientation' and sexual practice) does seem to be a big draw for disowned-feeling fundamentalists or conservatives in the mainline Protestant and evangelical churches.  For me personally, a homo drawn to a more fundamentalist(ic) worldview supposedly historically Christian, that would be perfectly fine if the Orthodox Church were as zealous to defend the purity of Christian teaching and practice from all other maladies of thinking and practice that might afflict the believers.   Unfortunately I don't see it, except in rather vague terms (in so many of the prayers, and in the more-specific Ecumenical Councils that are, however, subject to bishops' economy) - so the sweeping and clarified position against all homosexuality just can leave one wanting.  (Reflection 1:  divorce and remarriage.  The golden "out" for this one is that the act of divorce is one separatable act of sin, whereas the homosexual state is one ongoing and never-remitting, so happy-be-lonely to those afflicted with it.)  My view anyway...

Have you met pasadi? //:=)
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« Reply #14 on: August 10, 2011, 01:44:28 AM »

orthonorm, if this is really going to get moved to the private forum (which it should), could you please state your stance on homosexuality and Orthodoxy?

Should an unmarried heterosexual couple who is actively having sex commune in an Orthodox Church? I don't think so, it's no different than a homosexual couple either. Homosexuals and Heterosexuals have to remain completely chaste until marriage. But Homosexuals cannot get married in our church, so they have to remain chaste their whole lives.
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« Reply #15 on: August 10, 2011, 01:48:00 AM »

It's odd that you pawn this (like everything else) off on Protestantism, when Protestantism, at large, is more accepting of homosexuality. To suggest that these things should be a non-issue to the OC is silly. Have you been to Eastern Europe?
And yes, I know you have.

The more I read this, the more I realize how little you do know what you are talking when you post.

Please can you give you ANY backing for this.

God hates Fags much?

Or every other "fly over" State church minister you ain't seen write an op-ed in the Times?

Yeah, Good ol' America has just been sweet to the gays.

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« Reply #16 on: August 10, 2011, 01:48:37 AM »

Who is Gleb Podmoshenski?  What is significant about him?  (Sorry to be so ignorant.)
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« Reply #17 on: August 10, 2011, 01:49:38 AM »

Who is Gleb Podmoshenski?  What is significant about him?  (Sorry to be so ignorant.)
Only God knows exactly.
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« Reply #18 on: August 10, 2011, 01:49:55 AM »

Have you been to Eastern Europe?
And yes, I know you have.

Have you, besides your "tour abroad"?

And yes, I know you haven't.
I've spent 3 of the last 8 years in Russia, and I own a home there. My wife is Russian, and my children are citizens. I currently spend half the time there, and am heavily involved in business there. It's hardly a tour abroad. Please don't presume. I'm sorry that you feel the need to judge everything I say and try to characterize everyone and everything as being a product of the hipster culture that you are so clearly immersed in. I don't have time for that.

I was not making an accusation against augustin. I know where he's from, that's why I said it. I never made any assertions about government involvement, or not, in gay marriage, but I think that when people imply that church leaders, lay or not, should be able to speak in favor of homosexuality, that's absurd. I also think that accusing American, or "Protestant" culture, as to augustin these things are one in the same, of being less tolerant of homosexuality than thr old country, is even more absurd, and I'm no proponent of "tolerance".
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« Reply #19 on: August 10, 2011, 01:50:22 AM »

It's odd that you pawn this (like everything else) off on Protestantism, when Protestantism, at large, is more accepting of homosexuality. To suggest that these things should be a non-issue to the OC is silly. Have you been to Eastern Europe?
And yes, I know you have.

The more I read this, the more I realize how little you do know what you are talking when you post.

Please can you give you ANY backing for this.

God hates Fags much?

Or every other "fly over" State church minister you ain't seen write an op-ed in the Times?

Yeah, Good ol' America has just been sweet to the gays.



Westboro isn't even Christian, so that argument is out the door... I don't think any other groups go as far as they do...
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« Reply #20 on: August 10, 2011, 01:51:38 AM »

orthonorm, if this is really going to get moved to the private forum (which it should), could you please state your stance on homosexuality and Orthodoxy?

Should an unmarried heterosexual couple who is actively having sex commune in an Orthodox Church? I don't think so, it's no different than a homosexual couple either. Homosexuals and Heterosexuals have to remain completely chaste until marriage. But Homosexuals cannot get married in our church, so they have to remain chaste their whole lives.

Should someone who knowing lies? Eats too much. Gets angry at his co-workers chronically?

I can assure you heterosexuals having sex before marriage known to their Priest are communed. Over. And. Over. And. Over.

And what about masturbation?

And every other sin people do knowingly and repetitively.

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« Reply #21 on: August 10, 2011, 01:52:19 AM »

It's odd that you pawn this (like everything else) off on Protestantism, when Protestantism, at large, is more accepting of homosexuality. To suggest that these things should be a non-issue to the OC is silly. Have you been to Eastern Europe?
And yes, I know you have.

The more I read this, the more I realize how little you do know what you are talking when you post.

Please can you give you ANY backing for this.

God hates Fags much?

Or every other "fly over" State church minister you ain't seen write an op-ed in the Times?

Yeah, Good ol' America has just been sweet to the gays.


I've seen Fred Phelps's rallies. His church is about 8 strong.
How big were those anti-gay riots in Moscow?

The GHF bunch represents about .008 of American society, and it's plain hipsterism, as you would say, to generalize about the fly-over states.
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« Reply #22 on: August 10, 2011, 01:52:51 AM »

Westboro isn't even Christian, so that argument is out the door... I don't think any other groups go as far as they do...

Whatever. No true Scotsman again.

You would think after 345,362,568,248 times something has been pointed out, people would learn.
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« Reply #23 on: August 10, 2011, 01:54:01 AM »

It's odd that you pawn this (like everything else) off on Protestantism, when Protestantism, at large, is more accepting of homosexuality. To suggest that these things should be a non-issue to the OC is silly. Have you been to Eastern Europe?
And yes, I know you have.

The more I read this, the more I realize how little you do know what you are talking when you post.

Please can you give you ANY backing for this.

God hates Fags much?

Or every other "fly over" State church minister you ain't seen write an op-ed in the Times?

Yeah, Good ol' America has just been sweet to the gays.


I've seen Fred Phelps's rallies. His church is about 8 strong.
How big were those anti-gay riots in Moscow?

The GHF bunch represents about .008 of American society, and it's plain hipsterism, as you would say, to generalize about the fly-over states.

I've lived there. You ain't.

You have no idea what you are talking about.

And it has nothing to do with hipsterism.

Again, deflecting.

Where is your PROOF for your statement.

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« Reply #24 on: August 10, 2011, 01:54:15 AM »

orthonorm, if this is really going to get moved to the private forum (which it should), could you please state your stance on homosexuality and Orthodoxy?

Should an unmarried heterosexual couple who is actively having sex commune in an Orthodox Church? I don't think so, it's no different than a homosexual couple either. Homosexuals and Heterosexuals have to remain completely chaste until marriage. But Homosexuals cannot get married in our church, so they have to remain chaste their whole lives.

Should someone who knowing lies? Eats too much. Gets angry at his co-workers chronically?

I can assure you heterosexuals having sex before marriage known to their Priest are communed. Over. And. Over. And. Over.

And what about masturbation?

And every other sin people do knowingly and repetitively.


Yes, but if a very public member of the OCA came out in favor of masturbation, lying, premarital sex and gluttony, the fallout would be the same. They're all sins. What's your point?
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« Reply #25 on: August 10, 2011, 01:55:42 AM »

It's odd that you pawn this (like everything else) off on Protestantism, when Protestantism, at large, is more accepting of homosexuality. To suggest that these things should be a non-issue to the OC is silly. Have you been to Eastern Europe?
And yes, I know you have.

The more I read this, the more I realize how little you do know what you are talking when you post.

Please can you give you ANY backing for this.

God hates Fags much?

Or every other "fly over" State church minister you ain't seen write an op-ed in the Times?

Yeah, Good ol' America has just been sweet to the gays.


I've seen Fred Phelps's rallies. His church is about 8 strong.
How big were those anti-gay riots in Moscow?

The GHF bunch represents about .008 of American society, and it's plain hipsterism, as you would say, to generalize about the fly-over states.

I've lived there. You ain't.

You have no idea what you are talking about.

And it has nothing to do with hipsterism.

Again, deflecting.

Where is your PROOF for your statement.


Again, please stop assuming. I've lived in Georgia for quite a while, and lived briefly in MN and UT.

Which statement?
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« Reply #26 on: August 10, 2011, 01:55:58 AM »

I'm not saying that eastern Europe is more tolerant of homosexuality than urban America. Far from it. But when it comes to church, there is this laissez faire attitude many here in America do  not get.
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« Reply #27 on: August 10, 2011, 01:56:54 AM »

orthonorm, what is your stance on homosexuality and same-sex relationships?
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« Reply #28 on: August 10, 2011, 01:57:46 AM »

orthonorm, if this is really going to get moved to the private forum (which it should), could you please state your stance on homosexuality and Orthodoxy?

Should an unmarried heterosexual couple who is actively having sex commune in an Orthodox Church? I don't think so, it's no different than a homosexual couple either. Homosexuals and Heterosexuals have to remain completely chaste until marriage. But Homosexuals cannot get married in our church, so they have to remain chaste their whole lives.

Should someone who knowing lies? Eats too much. Gets angry at his co-workers chronically?

I can assure you heterosexuals having sex before marriage known to their Priest are communed. Over. And. Over. And. Over.

And what about masturbation?

And every other sin people do knowingly and repetitively.


Yes, but if a very public member of the OCA came out in favor of masturbation, lying, premarital sex and gluttony, the fallout would be the same. They're all sins. What's your point?

Why do you care and think this has one iota of an effect on anyone besides places like here?

Jim, I know you ain't been around long.

Financial scandal much?
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« Reply #29 on: August 10, 2011, 01:58:25 AM »

I'm not saying that eastern Europe is more tolerant of homosexuality than urban America. Far from it. But when it comes to church, there is this laissez faire attitude many here in America do  not get.
I actually agree with that, entirely, which is more than I can say for anything orthonorm has said.

What doesn't follow, however, is why regardless, the Church Herself should not be censuring people for these things.
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« Reply #30 on: August 10, 2011, 01:58:31 AM »

I'm not saying that eastern Europe is more tolerant of homosexuality than urban America. Far from it. But when it comes to church, there is this laissez faire attitude many here in America do  not get.

thing is, it isn't laissez-faire, it is entirely the church's business... We are slaves to Christ, and we submit ourselves to his Church. You cannot be an Orthodox Christian, and then tell the Church to stay out of your private life.
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« Reply #31 on: August 10, 2011, 01:59:16 AM »

Someone I personally know was actually googled by people in a mostly convert church and-gasp=found gay. and was driven out of that church, told on to the priest, called  to his office several times, for just admitting that publicly on a social network. This convinced me that was almost a cult.
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« Reply #32 on: August 10, 2011, 01:59:23 AM »

It's odd that you pawn this (like everything else) off on Protestantism, when Protestantism, at large, is more accepting of homosexuality. To suggest that these things should be a non-issue to the OC is silly. Have you been to Eastern Europe?
And yes, I know you have.

The more I read this, the more I realize how little you do know what you are talking when you post.

Please can you give you ANY backing for this.

God hates Fags much?

Or every other "fly over" State church minister you ain't seen write an op-ed in the Times?

Yeah, Good ol' America has just been sweet to the gays.


I've seen Fred Phelps's rallies. His church is about 8 strong.
How big were those anti-gay riots in Moscow?

The GHF bunch represents about .008 of American society, and it's plain hipsterism, as you would say, to generalize about the fly-over states.

I've lived there. You ain't.

You have no idea what you are talking about.

And it has nothing to do with hipsterism.

Again, deflecting.

Where is your PROOF for your statement.


Again, please stop assuming. I've lived in Georgia for quite a while, and lived briefly in MN and UT.

Which statement?

Ahh?? The one in bold. You ain't been alive to have lived anywhere quite a while.

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« Reply #33 on: August 10, 2011, 02:00:52 AM »

orthonorm, if this is really going to get moved to the private forum (which it should), could you please state your stance on homosexuality and Orthodoxy?

Should an unmarried heterosexual couple who is actively having sex commune in an Orthodox Church? I don't think so, it's no different than a homosexual couple either. Homosexuals and Heterosexuals have to remain completely chaste until marriage. But Homosexuals cannot get married in our church, so they have to remain chaste their whole lives.

Should someone who knowing lies? Eats too much. Gets angry at his co-workers chronically?

I can assure you heterosexuals having sex before marriage known to their Priest are communed. Over. And. Over. And. Over.

And what about masturbation?

And every other sin people do knowingly and repetitively.


Yes, but if a very public member of the OCA came out in favor of masturbation, lying, premarital sex and gluttony, the fallout would be the same. They're all sins. What's your point?

Why do you care and think this has one iota of an effect on anyone besides places like here?

Jim, I know you ain't been around long.

Financial scandal much?
The financial scandal you're referring to, which I'm plenty aware of, has nothing to do with this, and I don't think you'll find anyone on this board who is in support of it, whatever that would mean...

I'd like to see you answer devin...
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orthonorm
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« Reply #34 on: August 10, 2011, 02:00:56 AM »

I'm not saying that eastern Europe is more tolerant of homosexuality than urban America. Far from it. But when it comes to church, there is this laissez faire attitude many here in America do  not get.
I actually agree with that, entirely, which is more than I can say for anything orthonorm has said.

Thank God we ain't agreeing. It's a good sign on my part.
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« Reply #35 on: August 10, 2011, 02:01:21 AM »

I'm not saying that eastern Europe is more tolerant of homosexuality than urban America. Far from it. But when it comes to church, there is this laissez faire attitude many here in America do  not get.

thing is, it isn't laissez-faire, it is entirely the church's business... We are slaves to Christ, and we submit ourselves to his Church. You cannot be an Orthodox Christian, and then tell the Church to stay out of your private life.
that's what they taught you in Sunday school?
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« Reply #36 on: August 10, 2011, 02:01:51 AM »

orthonorm, if this is really going to get moved to the private forum (which it should), could you please state your stance on homosexuality and Orthodoxy?

Should an unmarried heterosexual couple who is actively having sex commune in an Orthodox Church? I don't think so, it's no different than a homosexual couple either. Homosexuals and Heterosexuals have to remain completely chaste until marriage. But Homosexuals cannot get married in our church, so they have to remain chaste their whole lives.

Should someone who knowing lies? Eats too much. Gets angry at his co-workers chronically?

I can assure you heterosexuals having sex before marriage known to their Priest are communed. Over. And. Over. And. Over.

And what about masturbation?

And every other sin people do knowingly and repetitively.


Yes, but if a very public member of the OCA came out in favor of masturbation, lying, premarital sex and gluttony, the fallout would be the same. They're all sins. What's your point?

Why do you care and think this has one iota of an effect on anyone besides places like here?

Jim, I know you ain't been around long.

Financial scandal much?

I'm trying to prove a point here, and I'm sorry, but I'm not going to be arguing with someone who disagrees with a basic, fundamental stance of the Orthodox Church. If you agree with the Church, then fine, we can continue with the discussion, if not, then I'm sorry, but I refuse to discuss it further... Like I said, groups like "Axios" are not Orthodox at all, and anyone in support of homosexual relationships are not in agreement with the Church, and therefore, have no reason to continue communing. We are members of the Church because we have one faith, if someone disagrees with that faith, then they are outside of the church.
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« Reply #37 on: August 10, 2011, 02:02:42 AM »

orthonorm, if this is really going to get moved to the private forum (which it should), could you please state your stance on homosexuality and Orthodoxy?

Should an unmarried heterosexual couple who is actively having sex commune in an Orthodox Church? I don't think so, it's no different than a homosexual couple either. Homosexuals and Heterosexuals have to remain completely chaste until marriage. But Homosexuals cannot get married in our church, so they have to remain chaste their whole lives.

Should someone who knowing lies? Eats too much. Gets angry at his co-workers chronically?

I can assure you heterosexuals having sex before marriage known to their Priest are communed. Over. And. Over. And. Over.

And what about masturbation?

And every other sin people do knowingly and repetitively.


Yes, but if a very public member of the OCA came out in favor of masturbation, lying, premarital sex and gluttony, the fallout would be the same. They're all sins. What's your point?

Why do you care and think this has one iota of an effect on anyone besides places like here?

Jim, I know you ain't been around long.

Financial scandal much?
The financial scandal you're referring to, which I'm plenty aware of, has nothing to do with this, and I don't think you'll find anyone on this board who is in support of it, whatever that would mean...

I'd like to see you answer devin...

I'd like this to go to private, so we can get a little more "honest".
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« Reply #38 on: August 10, 2011, 02:02:54 AM »

I'm not saying that eastern Europe is more tolerant of homosexuality than urban America. Far from it. But when it comes to church, there is this laissez faire attitude many here in America do  not get.

thing is, it isn't laissez-faire, it is entirely the church's business... We are slaves to Christ, and we submit ourselves to his Church. You cannot be an Orthodox Christian, and then tell the Church to stay out of your private life.
that's what they taught you in Sunday school?

It is what the Orthodox Church teaches. Do you read anything about the Church?
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« Reply #39 on: August 10, 2011, 02:03:42 AM »

orthonorm, if this is really going to get moved to the private forum (which it should), could you please state your stance on homosexuality and Orthodoxy?

Should an unmarried heterosexual couple who is actively having sex commune in an Orthodox Church? I don't think so, it's no different than a homosexual couple either. Homosexuals and Heterosexuals have to remain completely chaste until marriage. But Homosexuals cannot get married in our church, so they have to remain chaste their whole lives.

Should someone who knowing lies? Eats too much. Gets angry at his co-workers chronically?

I can assure you heterosexuals having sex before marriage known to their Priest are communed. Over. And. Over. And. Over.

And what about masturbation?

And every other sin people do knowingly and repetitively.



Nobody says those things aren't sins, however. Acknowledging the sin and failing is different from not trying and lying to oneself.

Most Christians are hypocrites, but I'd take hypocrites over people with no standards any day.
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88Devin12
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« Reply #40 on: August 10, 2011, 02:03:47 AM »

orthonorm, if this is really going to get moved to the private forum (which it should), could you please state your stance on homosexuality and Orthodoxy?

Should an unmarried heterosexual couple who is actively having sex commune in an Orthodox Church? I don't think so, it's no different than a homosexual couple either. Homosexuals and Heterosexuals have to remain completely chaste until marriage. But Homosexuals cannot get married in our church, so they have to remain chaste their whole lives.

Should someone who knowing lies? Eats too much. Gets angry at his co-workers chronically?

I can assure you heterosexuals having sex before marriage known to their Priest are communed. Over. And. Over. And. Over.

And what about masturbation?

And every other sin people do knowingly and repetitively.


Yes, but if a very public member of the OCA came out in favor of masturbation, lying, premarital sex and gluttony, the fallout would be the same. They're all sins. What's your point?

Why do you care and think this has one iota of an effect on anyone besides places like here?

Jim, I know you ain't been around long.

Financial scandal much?
The financial scandal you're referring to, which I'm plenty aware of, has nothing to do with this, and I don't think you'll find anyone on this board who is in support of it, whatever that would mean...

I'd like to see you answer devin...

Answer to what?
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88Devin12
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« Reply #41 on: August 10, 2011, 02:04:51 AM »

orthonorm, if this is really going to get moved to the private forum (which it should), could you please state your stance on homosexuality and Orthodoxy?

Should an unmarried heterosexual couple who is actively having sex commune in an Orthodox Church? I don't think so, it's no different than a homosexual couple either. Homosexuals and Heterosexuals have to remain completely chaste until marriage. But Homosexuals cannot get married in our church, so they have to remain chaste their whole lives.

Should someone who knowing lies? Eats too much. Gets angry at his co-workers chronically?

I can assure you heterosexuals having sex before marriage known to their Priest are communed. Over. And. Over. And. Over.

And what about masturbation?

And every other sin people do knowingly and repetitively.



Nobody says those things aren't sins, however. Acknowledging the sin and failing is different from not trying and lying to oneself.

Most Christians are hypocrites, but I'd take hypocrites over people with no standards any day.

precisely... there is a huge difference between, say, an alcoholic who keeps falling and getting back up, and an alcoholic who says that what he's doing is fine and ok.

homosexuals must live completely chaste lifestyles, if one has a "partner", then one is clearly actively rejecting the teachings of the church.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2011, 02:05:57 AM by 88Devin12 » Logged
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Если бога нет, то все позволено


« Reply #42 on: August 10, 2011, 02:05:32 AM »

It's odd that you pawn this (like everything else) off on Protestantism, when Protestantism, at large, is more accepting of homosexuality. To suggest that these things should be a non-issue to the OC is silly. Have you been to Eastern Europe?
And yes, I know you have.

The more I read this, the more I realize how little you do know what you are talking when you post.

Please can you give you ANY backing for this.

God hates Fags much?

Or every other "fly over" State church minister you ain't seen write an op-ed in the Times?

Yeah, Good ol' America has just been sweet to the gays.


I've seen Fred Phelps's rallies. His church is about 8 strong.
How big were those anti-gay riots in Moscow?

The GHF bunch represents about .008 of American society, and it's plain hipsterism, as you would say, to generalize about the fly-over states.

I've lived there. You ain't.

You have no idea what you are talking about.

And it has nothing to do with hipsterism.

Again, deflecting.

Where is your PROOF for your statement.


Again, please stop assuming. I've lived in Georgia for quite a while, and lived briefly in MN and UT.

Which statement?

Ahh?? The one in bold. You ain't been alive to have lived anywhere quite a while.


I don't know, how about this list:
http://www.gaychurch.org/Find_a_Church/find_a_church.htm
How many of these churches are Protestant? How many aren't?

And what is this age obsession? I'm 26. I've seen pictures of you on this board. You're clearly not an old man. You might be what, 8-10 years older than me? I lived in GA for 2 years, and my fathers family is from there. I didn't say born and raised, I said lived, which is what you accused me of having not done. Like most of your accusations, it was off base. Your insistence on personally attacking me every time we disagree is incredible.
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It is not the task of Christianity to provide easy answers to every question, but to make us progressively aware of a mystery. God is not so much the object of our knowledge as the cause of our wonder.
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orthonorm
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« Reply #43 on: August 10, 2011, 02:05:39 AM »

I'd like to see you answer devin...

I did.

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augustin717
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« Reply #44 on: August 10, 2011, 02:06:05 AM »

I'm not saying that eastern Europe is more tolerant of homosexuality than urban America. Far from it. But when it comes to church, there is this laissez faire attitude many here in America do  not get.

thing is, it isn't laissez-faire, it is entirely the church's business... We are slaves to Christ, and we submit ourselves to his Church. You cannot be an Orthodox Christian, and then tell the Church to stay out of your private life.
that's what they taught you in Sunday school?

It is what the Orthodox Church teaches. Do you read anything about the Church?
The books say many things, it doesn't mean they are actually gonna be scrupulously enforced. But you'll noy get it.
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