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Author Topic: Over 1/2 Million Coming into the Orthodox Church  (Read 13313 times) Average Rating: 0
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Orthodoc
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« Reply #45 on: March 10, 2010, 09:13:26 AM »

Forgive me, but this news must be incorrect.

I know a monk who has been involved in working with the Giron group in Guatemala, and he was quite certain that there were 60,000 - 80,000 people, and based on his experience, he should know.

Half a million people would be 6% of the entire population of Mexico, and so if this were true, it would have been covered in a lot of secular news sources in Guatemala as well.

I hope I'm wrong, but this doesn't pass the small test.

I tend to agree.  We orthodox are known for our inflated statistics.  I'm still looking for all those 300 million Orthodox the EP thinks he is the spiritual leader of. 

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« Reply #46 on: March 10, 2010, 10:38:48 AM »

I'm still looking for all those 300 million Orthodox the EP thinks he is the spiritual leader of. 
Where does he claim that (other than in your deranged heads and embittered hearts which are so far from Orthodox Phronema you wouldn't recognise true Orthodox Christianity if you tripped over it)?
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« Reply #47 on: March 10, 2010, 10:41:19 AM »

Quote
So they think that the Patriarch of the Phanar

Last time I checked, there was no "patriarch of the Phanar". Or is it how they they translate  "icumenikos patriarchis" into English?

It would seem His All Holiness Patriarch Bartholomew is the only Orthodox Bishop on this forum that it is OK not to use the proper title for.


You mean the Patriarch of All the Barbarian Lands?
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« Reply #48 on: March 10, 2010, 10:42:40 AM »

Quote
So they think that the Patriarch of the Phanar

Last time I checked, there was no "patriarch of the Phanar". Or is it how they they translate  "icumenikos patriarchis" into English?

It would seem His All Holiness Patriarch Bartholomew is the only Orthodox Bishop on this forum that it is OK not to use the proper title for.


You mean the Patriarch of All the Barbarian Lands?

Thank you for proving my point.
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ialmisry
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« Reply #49 on: March 10, 2010, 10:49:22 AM »

I'm still looking for all those 300 million Orthodox the EP thinks he is the spiritual leader of. 
Where does he claim that (other than in your deranged heads and embittered hearts which are so far from Orthodox Phronema you wouldn't recognise true Orthodox Christianity if you tripped over it)?

Quote
Q. What is the role of the Ecumenical Patriarch among Orthodox Churches?
A. The Ecumenical Patriarch presides in historical honor among all Orthodox Primates, as "first among equals." He also traditionally serves as the focal point and spokesman for Orthodox Church unity, convening inter-Orthodox councils, as well as inter-Church and inter-faith dialogues.

Q. What is the Ecumenical Patriarchate?
A. The Ecumenical Patriarchate is the honorary and spiritual centre of the Orthodox Church throughout the world, tracing its history to the Day of Pentecost and the earliest Christian communities founded by the Apostles of Jesus Christ.

Q. How many Orthodox Christians are there world-wide?
A. 300 million. Geographically, its primary area of distribution lies along the coast of the (northeast) Mediterranean, in Eastern and Northern Europe, as well as in the Middle East. But the jurisdiction of the Ecumenical Patriarchate is worldwide.
http://patriarchate.org/patriarchate/faq

This one is for Augustine: can you spot the errors?
Quote
Q. What is the order of the Orthodox Patriarchates?
A. The most ancient Patriarchates, in an order of seniority already established by the 5th century, comprise Constantinople, Alexandria, Antioch and Jerusalem. In the 16th century, the Ecumenical Patriarch raised the Church of Moscow to the rank of Patriarchate, as occurred earlier with the Church of Serbia in the 14th century as well as later with the Churches of Romania in the 19th century and Bulgaria in the 20th century.
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Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth
ialmisry
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« Reply #50 on: March 10, 2010, 10:50:09 AM »

^ parakalo.
Quote
So they think that the Patriarch of the Phanar

Last time I checked, there was no "patriarch of the Phanar". Or is it how they they translate  "icumenikos patriarchis" into English?

It would seem His All Holiness Patriarch Bartholomew is the only Orthodox Bishop on this forum that it is OK not to use the proper title for.


You mean the Patriarch of All the Barbarian Lands?

Thank you for proving my point.
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Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth
Orthodoc
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Those who ignore history tend to repeat it.


« Reply #51 on: March 10, 2010, 11:02:27 AM »

I'm still looking for all those 300 million Orthodox the EP thinks he is the spiritual leader of. 
Where does he claim that (other than in your deranged heads and embittered hearts which are so far from Orthodox Phronema you wouldn't recognise true Orthodox Christianity if you tripped over it)?

Look at any press release to the news media  given out the GOA or America here in the U.S. 

Here are a few examples -

www.patriarchate.org/greek/athp/index.php?lang=en

www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1P2-7679843.html

www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1P1-22408705.html

Orthodoc





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Oh Lord, Save thy people and bless thine inheritance.
Grant victory to the Orthodox Christians over their adversaries.
And by virtue of thy Cross preserve thy habitation.
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« Reply #52 on: March 10, 2010, 11:11:41 AM »

I'm still looking for all those 300 million Orthodox the EP thinks he is the spiritual leader of. 
Where does he claim that (other than in your deranged heads and embittered hearts which are so far from Orthodox Phronema you wouldn't recognise true Orthodox Christianity if you tripped over it)?

Quote
Q. What is the role of the Ecumenical Patriarch among Orthodox Churches?
A. The Ecumenical Patriarch presides in historical honor among all Orthodox Primates, as "first among equals." He also traditionally serves as the focal point and spokesman for Orthodox Church unity, convening inter-Orthodox councils, as well as inter-Church and inter-faith dialogues.

Q. What is the Ecumenical Patriarchate?
A. The Ecumenical Patriarchate is the honorary and spiritual centre of the Orthodox Church throughout the world, tracing its history to the Day of Pentecost and the earliest Christian communities founded by the Apostles of Jesus Christ.

Q. How many Orthodox Christians are there world-wide?
A. 300 million. Geographically, its primary area of distribution lies along the coast of the (northeast) Mediterranean, in Eastern and Northern Europe, as well as in the Middle East. But the jurisdiction of the Ecumenical Patriarchate is worldwide.
http://patriarchate.org/patriarchate/faq

Lacking as you are in any Orthodox Phronema, its understandable that you would make such an obvious mistake and completely lack any insight in your error.
Read it again. The question is: "How Many Orthodox Christians are there world wide?" and the answer is "300 million". The Jurisdiction of the Ecumenical Patriarchate is indeed "worldwide" since it is has Dioceses, Exarchates, Vicariates, Metropolitanates, etc throughout the world, but that doesn't mean it has direct jurisdiction over every one of the 300 million Orthodox Christians mentioned. You simply misunderstood, thats all.
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« Reply #53 on: March 10, 2010, 11:24:49 AM »

http://www.patriarchate.org/greek/athp/index.php?lang=en

Scroll down on link to this quote:

"As Ecumenical Patriarch he transcends every national and ethnic group on a global level and today is the spiritual leader of approximately 250 million faithful world-wide."

He may not claim direct jurisdiction but he does claim to be the spiritual leader of all Orthodox Christians worldwide. Now stop all the accusations about how other Orthodox Christians lack Orthodox Phronema.
Did God ask you to be their judge?

« Last Edit: March 10, 2010, 11:27:02 AM by Tamara » Logged
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« Reply #54 on: March 10, 2010, 11:29:43 AM »

Father Deacon,
I thank you for this news, but I highly recommend that you do not use this forum to provide any further information.
Unfortunately, this forum has a terrible history of permitting disdainful and derogatory statements about the Oecumenical Patriarchate by posters and moderators who belong to other jurisdictions, so your news will be recieved with little welcome here. Basically, we who belong to the Oecumenical Patriarchate are not welcome on this forum. This forum is a good social network for American and Canadian Orthodox Christians in jurisdictions other than the Oecumenical Patriarchate, but no one will rejoice here at your news that so many souls are being received into the Orthodox Church unless you are in the "Self-Ruled Antiochian Archdiocese of America", ROCOR or the OCA. I know that these Churches themselves would never hold such an opinion, but its only a few of their "vocal" members of them who use this forum as a free soap box who tend to post here and hold these opinions. If their Bishops knew what they were saying on this forum, I'm sure they would be horrified.

George

Please find below the introductory message from The Right Reverend Dr. ANDREW (Vujisić) on this groundbreaking news of an ex Roman Catholic group in Guatemala who are in the process of coming into the holy Orthodox Church under the Ecumenical Patriarchate. This will be quite a process and take some years to complete, but this news is phenomenal. History in the making! Please visit the website for pictures and avenues for one to donate not only money but essential liturgical items i.e. chalice sets, liturgical vestments and Church supplies, Icons, computers, stock, or vehicles. As you well know, the vast majority of the population throughout Central and South America live well under what we consider poverty level. What better way to build your kingdom in heaven then to help support these poor souls seeking Christian fulfillment? Think of what you could provide with a chalice set or Icons for these beautiful people to kiss and give Glory to God. Please take the time and browse the website and view the photos (Adobe Flash required). If you have any questions feel free to ask. I also encourage you to please spread the word to family and friends because the need is great and the workers are few. Glory be to God in all things!

http://www.secretariat.orthodoxtheologicalinstitute.org/

In Christ,
Fr. Deacon Daniel Williamson



INTRODUCTORY MESSAGE


It is with great emotion and much joy that we welcome our virtual visitors from across the globe to this website, in which they can become familiar with, and participate in, the historic and providential work of the Holy Metropolis of Mexico through the General Secretariat for Pan-Orthodox Ministries, an outreach that reflects the very spirit of the Patriarchate of Constantinople, which is the fundamental canonical expression of the ecumenical dimensions of the message of the Gospel. The Ecumenical Patriarchate, whose loving care transcends linguistic, cultural, ethnic, national, economic, and gender barriers, has a canonical mandate and jurisdiction that extend over the oikouménē, or inhabited world, i.e., over all those territories that do not fall under the direct canonical jurisdiction of other autocephalous Churches. The Secretariat concretizes the fruit of the fervent love of the Ecumenical Throne for men and women of all races, and is the result of the vigilant attentiveness of the Most Reverend Metropolitan ATHENAGORAS, Archbishop of Mexico, Central America, Colombia, Venezuela, and the Islands of the Caribbean. The Secretariat is not an institution, organization, or association, but rather an integral part of the Theanthropic Body of our Lord Jesus Christ, to which all peoples are called. Without conscious participation in that Body, humanity is condemned to repeat the desperate and haunting cry: “I am alone… Alone! Alone, and opposed even to myself!” The unequivocal and diachronic message of St. John the Evangelist summarizes this sad reality, in these words: “the whole world lies under the sway of evil” (I John 5:19). The world has not accepted Christ as its ruler; it has another ruler, who “is cast out” (John 12:31).


Consequently, our response and posture toward the vagaries of this transitory life and fallen world should conform to the exhortation of the Holy Apostle Paul: “But this I say, brethren, the time is short: so that from now on even those who are married should be as though they were not; and those who weep, as though they wept not; and those who rejoice, as though they rejoiced not; and those who purchase, as though they possessed not; and those who use this world, as not misusing it: for the fabric of this world is passing away” (I Corinthians 7:29-31). What does this mean? Are we to shut ourselves off, indifferent to what is happening around us?  The answer is categorically and emphatically 'no'! Our Lord Jesus Christ is “the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world” (John 1:29). He said: “I have come as a Light into the world, so that whoever believes in Me should not abide in darkness... for I did not come to judge the world, but to save the world” (John 12:46, 47). Indeed to this end, He delivered His own flesh up to death “for the life of the world” (John 6:51), “so that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life” (John 3:16). We therefore have a solemn responsibility because we too have been called to participate in His salvific ministry and to be "the light of the world" (Matthew 5:14). Moreover, the Lord Himself gave us this commandment, "let you light so shine before others, that they may see your good works and glorify your Father who is in Heaven" (Matthew 5:16). We must never forget or abandon our spiritual and moral obligation towards the millions of needy and lost souls in distant lands who are our spiritual neighbors.


In response to this grave duty, the General Secretariat for Pan-Orthodox Ministries develops, implements, and supports ministries that reach thousands of people throughout Latin America. The Secretariat focuses on the promulgation of the Gospel, but also endeavors to bring Christ’s love in tangible ways through religious and vocational education, charity and service, and advocacy for justice. Currently, support is provided to 334 Orthodox Church communities in Central America, which have a total indigenous membership of 527,000. The ministries of the Secretariat also include a virtual seminary with 52 registered students, a community college in Guatemala, primary and secondary schools, and an active outreach to ‘Orthodox seekers’ in Latin America. In every service provided, the Secretariat endeavors to reflect the love and compassion of our Lord Jesus Christ and the phronema of the Ecumenical Throne through the expression of steadfast respect and sensitivity to the linguistic, cultural, ethnic, national, and economic diversity of communities with which it is in contact.


Our virtual visitors are encouraged to participate in this timely ministry through prayer and fasting, and through donations of time, money, talent, goods and services “for the harvest is great but the workers are few” (Matthew 9:37).


The Right Reverend Dr. ANDREW (Vujisić)
Archiepiscopal Vicar
and Administrator for the Parishes of Slavic Tradition
General Secretariat for Pan-Orthodox Ministries
Archdiocese of Mexico
Ecumenical Patriarchate
http://www.secretariat.orthodoxtheologicalinstitute.org/
« Last Edit: March 10, 2010, 11:37:53 AM by ozgeorge » Logged

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ialmisry
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« Reply #55 on: March 10, 2010, 11:43:27 AM »

I'm still looking for all those 300 million Orthodox the EP thinks he is the spiritual leader of.  
Where does he claim that (other than in your deranged heads and embittered hearts which are so far from Orthodox Phronema you wouldn't recognise true Orthodox Christianity if you tripped over it)?

Quote
Q. What is the role of the Ecumenical Patriarch among Orthodox Churches?
A. The Ecumenical Patriarch presides in historical honor among all Orthodox Primates, as "first among equals." He also traditionally serves as the focal point and spokesman for Orthodox Church unity, convening inter-Orthodox councils, as well as inter-Church and inter-faith dialogues.

Q. What is the Ecumenical Patriarchate?
A. The Ecumenical Patriarchate is the honorary and spiritual centre of the Orthodox Church throughout the world, tracing its history to the Day of Pentecost and the earliest Christian communities founded by the Apostles of Jesus Christ.

Q. How many Orthodox Christians are there world-wide?
A. 300 million. Geographically, its primary area of distribution lies along the coast of the (northeast) Mediterranean, in Eastern and Northern Europe, as well as in the Middle East. But the jurisdiction of the Ecumenical Patriarchate is worldwide.
http://patriarchate.org/patriarchate/faq

Lacking as you are in any Orthodox Phronema,

Nice personal attack. I have enough to know Ultramontanism and Phyletism when I see it, and not confuse Hellenism with universality.

Quote
its understandable that you would make such an obvious mistake and completely lack any insight in your error.
Read it again. The question is: "How Many Orthodox Christians are there world wide?" and the answer is "300 million". The Jurisdiction of the Ecumenical Patriarchate is indeed "worldwide" since it is has Dioceses, Exarchates, Vicariates, Metropolitanates, etc throughout the world, but that doesn't mean it has direct jurisdiction over every one of the 300 million Orthodox Christians mentioned. You simply misunderstood, thats all.
Do correct HDAH's misunderstanding (as Orthodoc pointed out):
Quote
As Ecumenical Patriarch he transcends every national and ethnic group on a global level and today is the spiritual leader of approximately 250 million faithful world-wide.
http://www.patriarchate.org/greek/athp/index.php?lang=en
« Last Edit: March 10, 2010, 11:45:42 AM by ialmisry » Logged

Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth
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« Reply #56 on: March 10, 2010, 11:49:06 AM »

Locked pending moderatorial review.
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Met. Demetrius's Enthronement

Disclaimer: Past posts reflect stages of my life before my baptism may not be accurate expositions of Orthodox teaching.

I served as an Orthodox priest from June 2008 to April 2013, before resigning for personal reasons
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