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Author Topic: Fr. Matta el Maskeen (Matthew the Poor)  (Read 5117 times) Average Rating: 0
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minasoliman
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« on: March 05, 2006, 01:07:25 PM »

Dearest (especially Stavro),

Which books/articles by Fr. Matta are the ones that are attacked/controversial?

Also, what are the charges brought up against Fr. Matta?

What books/articles have been written against Fr. Matta?

Is there a way where I can get any of those books?

God bless.

Mina
« Last Edit: March 05, 2006, 01:07:58 PM by minasoliman » Logged

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Timos
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« Reply #1 on: March 07, 2006, 09:56:16 AM »

His books can't be that bad. I remember the youth retreat @ Holy Cross (Cross Roads) gave us printed material and some of it was Fr. Matthew's guide to interpreting the scriptures. It was actually interesting.
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« Reply #2 on: March 08, 2006, 11:38:08 AM »

Dearest (especially Stavro),

Which books/articles by Fr. Matta are the ones that are attacked/controversial?

Also, what are the charges brought up against Fr. Matta?

What books/articles have been written against Fr. Matta?

Is there a way where I can get any of those books?

God bless.

Mina


It was mostly the book on prayer, "The ORthodox Prayer Life" that got recent attention ;because of him quoting mostly non Coptic saints. ÂÂ  Some of which are a little controversial, like St. Isaac of The Syrian. ÂÂ  And critisized because he's looked up as a Coptic example of spirituality but he teaching lots of stuff outside the Coptic Church (based heavily in EO and Catholicism as far as the saints quoted and discussed).   Although I think there are Egyptain/Arabic books that were also controversial.


He mostly is in "the dog house". ÂÂ  Because of publically critisizing Pope Shenouda back in the days, when he was arrested back when Anwar Sadat first came to power. ÂÂ  Pope Shenouda was critisized by him, during his few years in prison; because of some of the massive reforms he was brining to the Church. ÂÂ  Fr. Matta believed he was relying more on programs than on prayer and other traditional methods.


There was/is a good "Chrisitanity Today" article that came out on the subject of Both Pope Shenouda and Fr. Matta. ÂÂ  It came out around 2000. ÂÂ  I had trouble finding it, but if your scour the internet and take your time I bet you can find it. ÂÂ  It talks about the different kinds of Renewal both people were working to bring the Coptic Church.
« Last Edit: March 08, 2006, 11:39:25 AM by Addai » Logged

minasoliman
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« Reply #3 on: March 08, 2006, 12:38:01 PM »

Dear Addai,

I know which article you are talking about:

http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2001/015/2.38.html

God bless.

Mina

PS  I'm reading Orthodox Prayer Life now, and I find nothing wrong with it, and there is actually a hint in it that Fr. Matta believes we can't partake or see the essence of God.
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« Reply #4 on: March 12, 2006, 10:22:37 PM »

Quote
Which books/articles by Fr. Matta are the ones that are attacked/controversial?
Also, what are the charges brought up against Fr. Matta?
You can start with the list I gave you in the topic "Why do we sin" in the "Free-for-all" forum until I come up with a translation of a list of Matta's errors in all his books. They are numerous, so please be patient.

As for charges of misconduct and attacks against the Church, one has to consider his whole "career" as a monk to come up with a conclusive answer. You would have to examine the position of St. Macarius monastery in the Coptic Church after Chalcedon and the burning of the Alexandria library and school of Theology upon the arabic conquest,and how this great monastery has been transformed under the spiritual guidance of Matta El-Maskeen. You can visit the monastery and come up with your own assessment after you see the huge industrial advancements at this monastery and get an idea of the monks' routine, and compare it to other monasteries. Matta's life becomes very interestings if you consider his relation to President Saddat before and after 1981, his defeat at Papal elections twice, him being offered the Papal position by Saddat after the lawful Pope, H.H. Shenouda III was imprisoned in his own monastery, and how the synod refused such consecration and only to see them persecuted by Saddat, who wanted to go with the plan to split the Church anyways but got stopped because Khaled El-islambuli and Atta Tael assassinated the man, splitting him in two from the waist. If you consider the book " Church and Social service", in which he accused the Church of conspiracy and treason and caused the imprisonment of a popular Bishop, Samuel the Martyr, in Nasser's regime, together with the above, you will understand why Copts in Egypt have little respect for the man, and why his majority of vocal fans is in the diaspora.

We usually come up with totally different views, so you are on your own in studying Matta's life so you can come up with your own conclusions.  
Quote
What books/articles have been written against Fr. Matta?
Articles by H.H. in El-Kerazah magazine and seven books published against the heresies of Matthew the Poor. Will prepare a list of them later.
Quote
Is there a way where I can get any of those books?
I am not sure how far the translation of Matta's books into English have progressed. As for arabic books, you can always find them at the monastery of St. Macarius at Wadi El-Natron in Egypt and the last time I checked they were available in an independent bookstore called El- Ma7abah. It is one of the biggest christian bookstore in Egypt.  

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In that day there will be an altar to the LORD in the heart of Egypt, and a monument to the LORD at its border. (Isaiah 19:19)

" God forbid I should see the face of Judah or listen to his blasphemy" (Gerontius, Archmanidrite of the monastery of St. Melania)
arbible
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« Reply #5 on: June 27, 2006, 03:01:14 PM »

Dear Mina,

Please check out

HH Pope Shenouda III's reply concerning the theological and dogmatic opinions of the late Fr. Matta El-Meskeen
http://www.zeitun-eg.net/PopeShenoudaIIIs_reply_concerning_the_opinions_of_FrMattaElMeskeen_1991.zip

God Bless+
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arbible
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« Reply #6 on: June 27, 2006, 07:02:33 PM »

See also:
Medina, Sara. "Egypt's Copts in Crisis." TIME Magazine Archive Article 28 Sep. 1981. 27 Jun. 2006. http://time-proxy.yaga.com/time/archive/printout/0,23657,953135,00.html - Article containing segments attributed to Fr Matta in which he attacks the Coptic Orthodox Church and HH Pope Shenouda III.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2006, 07:04:06 PM by arbible » Logged
arbible
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« Reply #7 on: June 28, 2006, 02:14:31 PM »

Comment on above:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/arbible/message/31593?l=1
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EkhristosAnesti
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« Reply #8 on: June 28, 2006, 02:56:46 PM »

Are you finished yet bro?
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arbible
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« Reply #9 on: June 29, 2006, 01:12:18 PM »

http://www.rezgar.com/debat/show.art.asp?aid=68761
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arbible
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« Reply #10 on: June 29, 2006, 03:18:49 PM »

New Links added to Father Matta's Web site
English site launch: http://www.fathermatta.com/english/index.php

Audio:
http://www.fathermatta.com/arabic/audio_parts/73-03-01.mp3
http://www.fathermatta.com/arabic/audio_parts/90_13_2_jss-0002.mp3
« Last Edit: June 29, 2006, 03:21:18 PM by arbible » Logged
Νεκτάριος
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« Reply #11 on: June 29, 2006, 06:29:04 PM »

Regardless of how correct (and of that I don't pressume to know anything about an internal matter for Coptic Church) you are, simply spamming several treads with links doesn't lend much credibility to your position.  Why not stick around and actually join the discussion? 
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Salpy
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« Reply #12 on: June 29, 2006, 07:49:54 PM »

Welcome to the board, Arbible!  It is always nice to get a new member, especially one who is interested in matters concerning the Oriental Orthodox!  While your links are very interesting, you may want to get involved in some of our discussions.  I am sure you have much insight to give.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2006, 12:46:39 AM by Salpy » Logged

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